A holiday snowglobe with no snow?

[Just_Bob]

Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays and Crashless Rendering to all!

As I await for my educational lic. to be accepted by Newtek I was able break in to my son's place, as he was out, and steal some quality time with Lightwave to continue a project.

I have been working on a holiday themed snowglobe and I have ran into a bit of an annoying anomaly. Every item within the snowglobe appears upon rendering with the exception of the snow. The snow is a group of points that have been converted to one point polys and set to a medium sizing. The snow is a no-show after rendering but the snowman looks great. I did some cursory troubleshooting within the render options panel. I deselected all of the ray trace options and performed a render that resulted with the snow appearing. I then selected each ray trace option, one by one, and did a test render after each selection. Upon selecting ray trace refraction the snow polys disappeared but the rest of the interior objects appear as one would expect.

Any clue?

[SplineGod]

How are you generating the snow?

[Just_Bob]

How are you generating the snow?
The snow is just a bunch of single point polygons (created in modeler) that were placed within the globe. The scene is static, no particle animation.

[kevman3d]

Are your snow points behind a transparent surface? I don't think 1-point polys render behind transparent polys (or I could be wrong - So don't quote me on that one)

Also in LW9, only the Classic camera can render 1 point polys. So don't use the perspective camera.

What I would do would be to try using Hypervoxels on your 1-point poly object, then make sure to activate 'Raytrace Transparency' to show them behind your transparent surface...

[Just_Bob]

Are your snow points behind a transparent surface? I don't think 1-point polys render behind transparent polys (or I could be wrong - So don't quote me on that one)

Also in LW9, only the Classic camera can render 1 point polys. So don't use the perspective camera.

What I would do would be to try using Hypervoxels on your 1-point poly object, then make sure to activate 'Raytrace Transparency' to show them behind your transparent surface...
Hypervoxels! Sheesh, my head must have been up a really dark place. I cannot believe that I did not consider such an obvious approach in the first place.

Kev, thank you very much!

Thanks, as well, for the LW 9 tip. My son has LW 7.5b, I think. He didn't upgrade as he noved to XSI two years ago. But I have been having a great time using LW for about a year, on and off - when he's not gaming or working. LW has been such a joy to use that I had to give Wes a call and I hope my educational purchase of LW 9.0 is approved by Newtek soon. Truespace just became boring after a while.

Thanks, again, for the assist.

[Just_Bob]

Hypervoxels was indeed the solution to my problem. Kev, again, thank you. However, I have a "mercury flow effect" due to the proximity of the particles/single point polys. What is the best way to break the particles up so they will not flow together?

Perhaps producing two spheres, one inside another, and killing the polys - allowing for equal spacing of the points. Would that method work?

[kevman3d]

There was an option added back in LW8.3 (I think - Maybe it was 8.5) that let you deactivate the blending effect in Hypervoxels - Its simply a check box called 'Blending', found under the geometry tab - Deactivate this to switch off the blending between the HV's.

However, if you're running LW7.5, that's not gonna be an option, so you'll probably need to either space the points out more, or shrink the HV size to prevent them intersecting.

Alternatively, you could also just use the point cloud in a background layer, create a simple (and very tiny) sphere in a fresh layer, then use Multiply > Duplicate > Point Clone+ to clone it to the location of each point. Use the new geometrical spheres to render instead of using HV's...

[Just_Bob]

Kevman,

Thank you once again for your input.

I decided to drop the HV approach and chose to utilize low poly spheres instead, about one week ago. Without going into some boring details, my placement of the spheres resulted in something that was most undesirable and quite time consuming. It was a complete mess.

However, moments ago I performed a test using Point Clone+ after reading your reply. I produced a point cloud containing 24 points and continued on as you advised with excellent results. Point Clone+ is a tool that I have not explored at all, thanks for the tip. :clap:

Back to the snowglobe I go....

Thanks, again. :biggrin:

[Just_Bob]

Here is a rather basic test render of the globe after using Point Clone+. A crude example, yes, as it is not the final product. There is a bit of tweaking yet to do, obviously.

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f109/RobertJF/snowglobe_test.jpg

[kevman3d]

That's looking pretty good for a test! If you want to 'soften' the snow flakes, I'd suggest simply making the edges transparent - Either use the surface shader 'Edge transparency', or a gradient with an input of Incidence Angle.

Be keen to see your final result. :)

[Just_Bob]

That's looking pretty good for a test! If you want to 'soften' the snow flakes, I'd suggest simply making the edges transparent - Either use the surface shader 'Edge transparency', or a gradient with an input of Incidence Angle.

Be keen to see your final result. :)

Thank you, sir.

I was just testing the resulting use of point clone+, as you advised. The snow flake population will be increased and I have been experimenting with 'softening' the flakes as you have suggested, thank you - again. I'll post my results soon.

In other news; I shall not have to move my aging arse from point A to B to use Lightwave ever again. (thank the maker!) By 01-12-06 I will have my greedy little paws wrapped around my very own copy of LW 9.0, thanks to Mr. Ablan. Between his course-ware, Project Viper and Digital Car Studio (love that SSR!) I should have a pretty good training foundation available to me. Freedom at last!:rockandro

[kevman3d]

Woohoo! Sounds like you're well equipped to get into 3D. LW9 is a sexy beast... Enjoy the new toys!

[Just_Bob]

Woohoo! Sounds like you're well equipped to get into 3D. LW9 is a sexy beast... Enjoy the new toys!

Absolutely! I do so like new toys. :biggrin:

The one element that scares me, moving from my most limited experience with LW 7.5 to 9.0 (or just Lightwave overall), is nodals. I am completely clueless with all things that are of the nodes. I know that nodes have been present within other apps for quite sometime, but what are they like to work with?

I have a feeling that moving from LW 7.5 to 9.0, for me, is going to be like moving from night to day in a very short period of time.

But, I do adapt well to changes....

[kevman3d]

The one element that scares me, moving from my most limited experience with LW 7.5 to 9.0 (or just Lightwave overall), is nodals.

Don't worry - The overall LightWave operation in LW9 is still pretty much 'standard' as you probably were used to in 7.5 - Nodal is also 'integrated' as an extra button into the surface editor, so you don't HAVE to use it - You can still texture in the good old-fashioned way with layers and the texture editor.

Nodal is like everything else in LightWave - At first might look 'complicated', but its interface is quite intuitive, and its relatively easy to use once you understand some simple basics. If you compare it to Maya's Hypershade, its much easier to grasp imho - Though I could probably be somewhat biased in that opinion! lol! :biggrin:

[Just_Bob]

Don't worry - The overall LightWave operation in LW9 is still pretty much 'standard' as you probably were used to in 7.5 - Nodal is also 'integrated' as an extra button into the surface editor, so you don't HAVE to use it - You can still texture in the good old-fashioned way with layers and the texture editor.

Nodal is like everything else in LightWave - At first might look 'complicated', but its interface is quite intuitive, and its relatively easy to use once you understand some simple basics. If you compare it to Maya's Hypershade, its much easier to grasp imho - Though I could probably be somewhat biased in that opinion! lol! :biggrin:

Biased? Certainly not. :wink:

Kev, thanks for the heads-up on nodals. Somehow I was placed under the impression that nodals replaced most of what the surface editor offered in the past. I am quite happy to discover that my assumptions were incorrect, I have access to both options - that's good news to me.

By the way, LW 9.0 found its way to my door yesterday as did Dan Ablan's signature courseware. I need some advise, if you would not mind. I am quite familiar with LW 7.5, to a point, but 9.0 will be unfamiliar territory.

Would you advise that I explore Dan's courseware, just to familiarize myself with LW 9.0 (as I missed out on 8.0/8.5), before proceeding on to Project Viper and Gerald's SSR course?

Many thanks!

[kevman3d]

Would you advise that I explore Dan's courseware, just to familiarize myself with LW 9.0 (as I missed out on 8.0/8.5), before proceeding on to Project Viper and Gerald's SSR course?

What I would do would be install LW9 and play with it for a while - If it all starts to look confusing, hit the Courseware and work through it. Though to be honest, if you've been using 7.5, I think it shouldn't be to large a change...

If you feel comfortable, you could start into those other Tutorials and see how you fair. I think you should be fine... But I've no idea how much you're already familiar with so take my suggestions lightly... :biggrin:

[Just_Bob]

What I would do would be install LW9 and play with it for a while - If it all starts to look confusing, hit the Courseware and work through it. Though to be honest, if you've been using 7.5, I think it shouldn't be to large a change...

If you feel comfortable, you could start into those other Tutorials and see how you fair. I think you should be fine... But I've no idea how much you're already familiar with so take my suggestions lightly... :biggrin:

Sounds good to me. Thank you.

I have used LW7.5 on and off for a year, maybe a bit longer. I have received several gaming titles as gifts over the last year and have barely touched them (much to the annoyance of the gift givers) due my time with 7.5. So I think I'm safe.

I'm going to move the snowglobe project over to 9 as a 'get acquainted' exercise. With that said, I have removed the red dongle from the ziplock bag and I am ready for the installation! I shall return. :biggrin: